Delphi Murders trial: Day 12 live blog
INDIANAPOLIS (WISH) — Day 12 in the trial of Delphi Murders suspect Richard Allen begins Thursday morning at the Carroll County Courthouse in Delphi.
Allen, 52, is charged with murder and murder while committing or attempting to commit kidnapping in the deaths of 13-year-old Abigail “Abby” Williams and 14-year-old Liberty “Libby” German. The girls’ bodies were found near the Monon High Bridge near Delphi on Feb. 14, 2017, a day after they went missing.
Allen was first investigated in 2017 and again in October 2022. After a second police interview, he was taken into custody.
The trial began Oct. 18 and was expected to continue through mid-November. Originally, 16 Allen County residents sat as the jury on the case, but one juror was dismissed on Oct. 25.
Day 12 of the Delphi Murders trial was set to begin at 9 a.m. Thursday.
Tune into News 8 and follow our live blog throughout the day for the latest developments.
NOTE: The times listed in the blog headers are the times which the entries were added. Specific times for courtroom events will be listed in the entries if available. These notes are compiled from photographs of written notes provided by reporters in courtroom and emailed to the WISH-TV news desk.
For a brief summary of Day 11 in the Delphi Murders trial (Wednesday), scroll to the bottom of the page.
To view all of our previous trial coverage, click here, and follow News 8’s Kyla Russell on X as she covers the trial live from Delphi.
9 a.m.
News 8’s Kyla Russell is back in Delphi for continuing coverage of the double murder trial of Richard Allen.
According to pool notes shared with News 8, the jury is expected to hear two hours of audio during Thursday’s session. It is set to begin at 9 a.m.
11:22 a.m.
At 8:58 a.m. Allen is standing in the courtroom and appears to be praying as court is set to begin.
At 9:01 a.m. Judge Gull enters the courtroom and court is back in session without the jury present.
The state moves to admit an exhibit that the defense objects to, saying they have never seen it before. Gull does not admit that exhibit.
The state moves to admit photos of Allen from his phone, arguing that they would like the jury to be able to see what Allen looked like before his arrest. The defense wants the dates on the photos removed. Judge Gull says the defense can review and the matter will be revisited after lunch.
Prosecutor Nick McLeland tells the judge they are planning to admit 7 Department of Corrections phone calls to Allen’s wife and mother. The defense objects because they say the prosecution is not offering one of the phone calls in the time where Allen said he is innocent and describes being mentally tortured and “killed” at the Westfield Correctional Unit.
Defense attorney Brad Rozzi says “what the State is omitting is an attempt to represent facts to the jury outside (of context).” McLeland says the calls are complete on their own. The defense claims the state is violating Allen’s rights.
Rozzi gives Gull a transcript of the omitted call, references certain times in the transcript where Allen mentions the conditions at Westville and says he is innocent. Rozzi claims the overall calls are “one continues communication.” Rozzi gives Gull two more transcripts and says “you play them all or you play none.”
Gull admits the calls over the defense’s objection and says the defense can play the ommited call if they so choose and their argument would be more valid if the state was trying to admit incomplete phone calls.
Rozzi says the case law doesn’t agree with what Gull is saying. Defense attorney Andrew Baldwin argues that in the calls the state want to present, the calls they want to omit are referenced, and that would be confusing to the jury.
Defense attorney Jennifer Auger references another exhibit, which is Allen’s Google search history. Gull says that will be handled later, again, after lunch.
The jury enters the courtroom at 9:28 a.m.
Gull says the jury again had supervised contact with their phones.
At 9:30 a.m. the state called Indiana State Police Master Trooper Brian Harshman. Harshman tells the jury he has been with the ISP for 30 years. He says he became involved in the Delphi investigation in April 2020.
Harshman tells the jury he became “the phone guy,” meaning he monitored Allen’s communication from inside custody to the outside world. He says he monitored calls, video chats, and texts. He says he has listened and relistened to 700 hours of Allen’s calls.
Harshman tells the jury that Allen either calls his wife or his mother. Harshman says that yes, Allen makes incriminating statements. The prosecution references a call on Nov. 11, 2022 that Allen made to his wife Kathy. Allen tells here that he would call the detectives and “tell them whatever they want to hear,” if things became too much for her.
The prosecution plays a call from Nov. 14, 2022 that Allen made to Kathy. Allen says on the call “I don’t want to upset you anymore.” “Tell the investigators to come get me, I will tell them whatever they want me to.” Kathy says in the call “I wish I could hug you.”
News 8’s Kyla Russell reports that Allen has his head down in the courtroom and his wife is crying while these calls are played.
During the calls Allen is crying loudly, he says “I’m sorry, I’m sorry. I know what you told me, I believe you. You take care of yourself, ok?” Kathy says “you get the help you need.” Allen responds “I’m sorry baby, I wish I could see you babe, you don’t know what I would give to see you one last time. I’ll see you in the next life, you take care of the family for me.”
The prosecution plays another call from April 2, 2023 from Allen to his mother Janice. Harshman says this call is about Allen saying he has found Jesus Christ.
Janice says “It’s good to hear from you.” Allen says he’s been trying to get a hold of Kathy, Janice says they’ve had some bad storms and tornadoes. Allen says they had hail at the prison. He asks Janice to tell Kathy he is ok and he will try to get through to her.
Janice tells Allen that she started going to church after a car accident in 2022. Allen tells her that is good, that he did not know she was going. Janice says “He’s been sparing my life for a reason all these years.”
Allen asks “Did Kathy tell you that I told her the other day that I accepted the lord Jesus Christ as my savior?” Jance says “That’s so wonderful.” He tells Janice he will try to get a hold of Kathy and then he will try to sleep because he has not slept.
Allen tells Janice “Got a family that will always love me, he won’t let this last forever, we’re going to be back all together some day. It may be when we are all in heaven. He is going to work a miracle out of all of it. He already has, Kathy sent me a bible.” Allen says he accepted God on March 21, 2023.
Allen says he wants Kathy to thank one of their doctors for saving his life because he suggested Kathy give him a bible. Allen tells Janice he loves her.
The prosecution plays another call from April 3, 2023 that Allen made to his wife. Allen says “I did it. I killed Abby and Libby.” Kathy says “No you didn’t, no you didn’t dear. Don’t say that, you weren’t feeling well, they messed up your meds.”
Kathy asks “why would you say that?” Allen responds “Maybe I did?” Kathy says “they are messing with your mind, something is not right. They are screwing with you there. Don’t you ever say you did it, I know you didn’t.” Allen responds “I think I did.” Kathy says “they’re fooling with you, trying to get you to say things.” Allen asks to apologize to the families. Kathy says “just don’t talk anymore.”
The prosecution plays another call from May 10, 2023. Allen called Kathy at 5:03 a.m. Kathy says “Are you there?” Allen responds “I am!” Kathy says “hi honey, it’s good to hear your voice, are they gonna move you?” Allen says “I don’t know, I think maybe I am losing my mind.” Allen asks Kathy if she is ok. Kathy says “we’ve all lost our minds at this point.”
Allen asks Kathy if he can trust Brad and Andy, his attorneys. Kathy says “yes they are our lawyers.” Allen says “I think I need to tell you something, I need you know that I did this.” Kathy says “dear, there’s no way. I love you honey but no, you have not done anything, you are not well.” Allen says again that he is losing his mind and says it feels like it’s taking forever. “I’m just trying to be at peace with everything,” Kathy says. Allen says he had a dream that he needed to let Kathy go. Kathy says “you’re dreaming things again.” “I have to let you know I did it,” Allen says.
The prosecution plays a call from May 10, 2023 at 11:13 a.m. The call is from Allen to his wife. Allen asks “I need to know if you still love me.” Kathy responds “I do.” Allen asks “and everybody else will as well honey?” Kathy says yes.
Allen says “I may have to spend the rest of my life in here, I don’t understand.” Kathy says “you’re not well.” Allen says “I’m well, yes. I am honey. If I get the electric chair…” Kathy says “That’s not going to happen. this isn’t right, they’ve messed you up so bad.” Allen says “I did it. I’ve got someone listening to me right now.” Kathy tells him “no you didn’t, we’re gonna be back together.” Allen tells her “I’ve been trying to let you go.” She reponds “I’ll be with you, please stop talking.”
The prosecution plays a call from June 5, 2023 between Allen and Kathy. Kathy says “get your coffee or snacks, whatever you need babe.” Allen says he “hates using that money when I don’t even know where it came from.” Kathy says “doesn’t matter, it’s in there. Everyone is thinking of you.” Allen says “I feel like I’ve lost my mind, like I’m in hell.” Kathy tells him “well you’re kinda living in it right now.”
Allen says “she knows that I done it, right?” Kathy says “I don’t want to think about that.” Allen says “I’m just in a really frustrating spot right now. Nobody will talk to me. Don’t feel like anybody is willing to be honest with me right now.” Kathy tells Allen she is trying to get someone “in there to pray with you.”
The prosecution plays a call from June 11, 2023 between Richard and Kathy. Allen says “I did it. Kathy I did it. Do you still love me?” Kathy says “yes dear but you didn’t do it. Why do you say that? Why do you say it?”
Allen says “I don’t want to upset you.” Kathy tells him she is already upset. Allen says he feels like he’s lost his mind. Kathy says “you can’t call me and talk like this ok?” Allen says “I’m so sorry baby.” Kathy tells him she cannot talk to him right now. Allen says “I didn’t want to do this, honey I’m so sorry. You aren’t going to do any to yourself ok. Probably going to have to kill myself now.”
Kathy says “Stop. You can’t call me and talk like this.” Allen asks “why are you so mad at me?” She responds “I’m not mad, I’m upset.” Allen says “can’t tell you what’s been going through my mind, feel like I’m already in hell. I don’t understand what’s going on.” Kathy says “neither do I.”
Allen says “I guess I’m just going to have to stop calling. I’m sorry.” Kathy says “you can’t call and talk like this.”
At this point Harshman describes Allen’s demeanor as subdued, and that he believed he “was not under stress.”
The prosecution moves ahead to August of 2024. He shows the jury a report from Dr. Monica Wala, the psychologist that worked with Allen. In the report, Allen described what he did on on the day of the murders. In the report, Allen said he went to his parents’ home, didn’t go to lunch with them. He bought a six pack of beer, drank three of them and went to the trails. He said he saw the girls and “did something to his gun and a bullet fell out.” He told them “down the hill.” Allen said in the report that he thought the girls were older and intended to rape them. He then said he saw a van and killed them. He then covered their bodies with sticks and left, according to the report.
Harshman tells the jury that this is the first report he’d seen with details from Allen on the crime. He says the detail that stuck out was about the van, prior to that, he had not heard about a van. “The only person that would have seen a van there would have been Libby, Abby and the person that killed them,” Harshman told the jury.
Harshman tells the jury that he looked up to see who lived at that residence and found who owned it.
He ran a BMV check on Brad Weber, the man who owned the property. Harshman realized that Weber owned a 2000 Ford Econoline van.
The state enters the van as an exhibit. Harshman said he got reports from Weber early on in the investigation. He said that he interviewed Weber in August of 2024. He said that none of the reports from the day of the murders reported that Weber drove a van.
Harshman said he didn’t think those reports were public. He tells the jury he filed a report on his interview with Weber.
News 8’s Kyla Russell reports that it is important to note that Dr. Wala testified Wednesday that Allen made the specific confession involving the van in May of 2023 and that Harshman interviewed Webber in August of 2024.
The prosecution plays the “down the hill” video for Harshman. Harshman is viewing the stabilized version, which is time-stamped Feb. 13, 2017.
Harshman received Libby’s health app data from ISP Sgt. Cecil, who was the State Police’s phone expert.
Harshman tells the jury that Libby’s phone stopped moving at 2:32:39 p.m. that day. Prosecutor Nick McLeland asks him how that information aligns with what he got from Weber.
Harshman says “van was on that road between 2:27 p.m. and 2:30 p.m. He tells the jury he recognizes the voice from Allen’s jail phone calls, and that the voice is the same as bridge guy.
At 11:10 a.m. defense attorney Brad Rozzi begins his cross examination of Harshman. Harshman says there were 14,000 tips about the crime, many were identified as being about bridge guy’s voice.
The jury tells Judge Gull they need a break and court is in recess at 11:15 a.m.
1:02 p.m.
Court is back in session at 11:32 a.m.
Defense attorney Brad Rozzi continues his cross examination of ISP Master Trooper Harshman.
Harshman confirms that he read reports about Brad Webber from February 2017 from two different agents.
Rozzi says that Harshman’s theory doesn’t take into consideration that Weber could have looked at his phone or gone to the gas station, because he believes the van had to be there at 2:20 p.m. to 2:30 p.m.
Rozzi asks Harshman if Weber could have been involved in the crime if he is placed there at that time. Harshman says no.
Rozzi asks if Allen had an injection, would that have affected his voice. The prosecution objects to the question and says that it calls for speculation.
Harshman responds that he did not have any clue what medication Allen was on while he was listening to his phone calls. Harshman agrees that Allen lost privacy when in custody. Rozzi asks if seeing video of Allen’s cell would be helpful for context. Harshman says he doesn’t believe so.
Harshman says he had never been asked to monitor someone in a pre-trial situation like Allen before.
Rozzi references the May 2023 confession from Allen where he said he was “lying in wait.” Rozzi points out that in the bridge guy video, the man behind the girls was walking. Harshman says “he could have very well been lying in wait, and then the girls walked by and he followed.”
Rozzi says Allen’s reference to the van was general, not specific. “Is that the only van in Carroll County at the time?” Rozzi asked. Harshman says “that was the only van on 625 at the time.”
Harshman says he has been listening to Allen’s calls since the trial has started and continues to report if needed. Rozzi says Allen also proclaims his innocence on calls, Harshman says he notes that.
Harshman also told the jury he has visited Westville 2 or 3 times over the course of the investigation and visited Allen’s cell at the Cass Couty Jail. He tells the jury his cell has a table, a small commissary and a shower.
Harshman tells the jury he has “possibly seen” video of Allen eating his feces. He says Allen’s actions are because he is in constant need of attention. He tells the jury that Allen said that on phone calls.
Harshman told the jury he has seen Allen “rolling around in food and maybe feces.”
Rozzi tells Harshman that he should have said something to the medical staff, Harshman says that would be out of his lane.
Rozzi references the Nov. 2022 call where Allen says he was “willing to do whatever it took to make sure his wife didn’t take the heat.” He mentions the April 2022 call where Allen referenced a call he made to his stepdad. Harshman confirms that Allen did make a call earlier that day to his parent’s house at 3:12 a.m. He confirms that Allen made a call that same day at 8:45 a.m.
Prosecutor McLeland continually objects and Rozzi keeps asking questions. Gull calls for them to approach the bench.
Continuing, Rozzi says the bulk of the confessions came in April through June of 2023. He asks Harshman if that was the same time that Allen was engaged in “bizarre behaviors.” Harshman says yes.
Harshman says the specific confession from May 2023 had detail only the killer would know.
12:19 p.m. Court is in recess for lunch.
Brief summary of Day 10 in the Delphi Murders trial
The first person to testify Wednesday was clinical psychologist Dr. Monica Wala. Wala is a contractor and lead psychologist at the Indiana Department of Corrections at the Westville Correctional Unit, where Allen was housed.
Wala said that she started seeing Allen in 2022. At the start, she was the only person to work with him. Over time, other professionals — including psychiatrists — began seeing him.
Ed. Note: An important distinction between psychologists and psychiatrists is that psychiatrists are medical doctors who can prescribe medications, while psychologists do not have a medical degree and generally cannot prescribe medications.
Wala said when she met with Allen, he was unshackled and seated in a cubicle. She described Allen as being on suicide watch and was watched every 15 minutes by a suicide companion.
Wala told the jury on April 5, 2023 Allen discussed his case with her, unprompted.
In her report from that day, she said Allen told her, “I killed Abby and Libby” and became tearful. Wala said Allen told her “he made sure they were dead because he did not want them to suffer.”
Wala said on May 3, 2023, Allen shared his version of events from Feb. 13, 2017.
According to Wala, Allen told her that on Feb. 13, 2017, he went to see his parents on the morning of the murders. He said he decided not to go with lunch with his mom, and decided to drink three beers and went to the bridge. He told Wala he saw the girls, that he wanted to rape the girls.
Wala said Allen told her he followed the girls, and while walking, a bullet fell from his gun. Then, he told the girls, “down the hill.” He said he planned on raping them, but saw a van and became scared. He then told the girls to cross a creek, cut their throats, and covered their bodies with branches.
Wala said Allen told her he’s been “selfish all of his life” and that he wanted to apologize to Libby and Abby’s families.
“I just want to sign my confession,” Wala said Allen told her.
Wala told the court that she initially believed Allen’s behaviors in his jail cell — including eating feces — weren’t genuine, but eventually changed her mind.
“It was getting to the point where it almost doesn’t matter whether he is faking it or not faking, because he is deteriorating,” Wala said.
During cross examination, Wala admitted to following the case via podcasts and Facebook groups before and during treatment, using a prison data base to look up info, and talking to Allen about the case.
Wala said she once told Allen that he had supporters online: “There are people on your side out there.”
Dr. Wala is no longer working with the Department of Correction. “They had to do an investigation,” she told the court.
Brad Weber, who owns property near the Monon High Bridge where the girls were found, was the next to testify.
On the day the girls went missing in February 2017, Weber told investigators that he went to work and, after that, worked on ATM machines.
Defense attorney Andrew Baldwin asked Weber if he drove straight home after work on Feb. 13, 2017, to which Weber said he dropped off a trailer. Baldwin said that was earlier in the day, adding that Weber originally told police he went to work on ATM machines after work.
This prompted Weber to scream “That’s not correct!” and to deny Baldwin’s claim multiple times.
Baldwin then gave Weber a subpoena, the details of which were not disclosed, and court adjourned for Wednesday.
New push to tell Delphi Murders jury about Odinism
Defense attorneys for Richard Allen on Wednesday made a new request to tell the jury in the Delphi Murders trial about evidence of Odinism.
The request was part of a new request filed Wednesday morning asking Judge Frances Gull to admit evidence about a connection between Odinism and the murders of Abby Williams and Libby German.
It’s the second such request filed by Allen’s attorneys since testimony began in his trial.
Judge Gull has previously rejected defense requests to present the ritualistic sacrifice theory to the jury.
In the same filing, Allen’s attorneys ask to be allowed to present evidence of 3rd party suspects.
The defense filing cites testimony from a forensic pathologist who told jurors that as many as four knives may have been used in the killings.
Judge Gull did not indicate when she might rule on the request.